SCCAForums.com

01 FS Z28:

And from a worker standpoint it's not fair for them to stand out there, the kids can't work the course and pay their dues so to speak. 

FWIW, the kids work a full assignment, just not on course, waivers, etc.   I think there are enough jobs (at 8 entrants) they can do that would free up someone to work course. 

 

Are the FJr classes subject to the minimum participation rules?   

Are they National Champions, or National Winners? 

 

Since their membership dues are less-----

In light of this fact is it fair to the rest of the winners that their Block of wood is the same size as the "full-price" members.

In regards to overall fairness this needs to be addressed RIGHT AWAY !

(what a screwed up situation !  YOU can't go to war at eleven years old but you race all over parking lots.....WITHOUT A LEGAL DRIVERS LICENSE !!!)

---

Trying to get faster

If it makes you all feel any better, I did feel a little bad about signing my son up and 'taking' one of the spots.  For that matter, I feel about the same amount of bad for signing up myself.  I have no intention of running more than this single Pro Solo this year.  It's a local event for me geographically, and in most cases I can't see the point of running Pros in P1 with the index. Oddly enough, it looks like we could actually have a full EP class in Toledo - I can't remember the last time a prepared class had enough entrants at a Pro to make it's own class.

I'm pretty sure that everybody had the same opportunity to register, and this event didn't fill up all that fast, so I can't really see why people are picking on the kids as being the ones who are keeping others from getting in.  Some of these kids will be travelling to multiple Pros and Tours this year and are quite serious (mine not being one of these serious kids).  Why not just pick on anyone who is only planning to run one event?

I have found that the Pro format is really neat for the kids.  For one thing, it is really great to be able to watch two karts off the line to get a feel for how close the motors and gearing are between competitors.  The Toledo Pro had a great turnout of Jr karts last year, and we had a great time.  Looks like this year will have a similar turnout.

-Chris       

I didn't even realize that we had FJr's at Arkansas. 

-Steve                                                                                                                                                           wishes he signed up for Toledo instead of DC

 

---

Steve Rife
ETRSCCA

Howdy,

As a parent, the thing I wish national would put in place for tours/pros/nationals is babysitting... Not more FJ stuff.

 :-)

Mark

Chris Raglin:

I'm pretty sure that everybody had the same opportunity to register, and this event didn't fill up all that fast, so I can't really see why people are picking on the kids as being the ones who are keeping others from getting in. 

Agreed here,  I signed up weeks after registration opened and still got in.  If you didn't, you were snoozing.  Shame on you. 

---

Jer
1993 MR2 #196 ES
2005 Lotus Elise (retired)
1999 Dodge 4X4 tow vehicle
1993 Miata (just tired)
1987 Corolla Lemons car
1984 Citation Lemons car

Surferjer:

Chris Raglin:

I'm pretty sure that everybody had the same opportunity to register, and this event didn't fill up all that fast, so I can't really see why people are picking on the kids as being the ones who are keeping others from getting in. 

Agreed here,  I signed up weeks after registration opened and still got in.  If you didn't, you were snoozing.  Shame on you. 

 x3.  I signed up for Toledo before I could sign up for DC or Atlanta in case I didn't get in to the others. 

---

Mark Pilson
owner of STS2 Honduh
co-driver of HS Subaru (race tires rule)

marka:

Howdy,

As a parent, the thing I wish national would put in place for tours/pros/nationals is babysitting... Not more FJ stuff.

 :-)

Mark

FJr = Babysitting.

You hand the kid and the kart off to the Youth Steward and walk away for the duration of the heat.

Don't laugh...I've seen it done. 

--Andy

 

Howdy,

Andy Hollis:

marka:

Howdy,

As a parent, the thing I wish national would put in place for tours/pros/nationals is babysitting... Not more FJ stuff.

 :-)

Mark

FJr = Babysitting.

You hand the kid and the kart off to the Youth Steward and walk away for the duration of the heat.

Don't laugh...I've seen it done. 

--Andy

Are 15 month olds eligible for FJr yet?

:-)

I was really only half kidding with that babysitting comment... We're scheduled for three Pros this year.  Hopefully work assignments and run heats work out so that one of us is free or life is gonna suck for someone.

Mark

i had an idea for a fenced in playground at grissom, could probably of gotten lowes or menards to donate a swingset and some fence, could  easily of had a dog park also

marka:

Howdy,

As a parent, the thing I wish national would put in place for tours/pros/nationals is babysitting... Not more FJ stuff.

 :-)

Mark

Just put the kids in the Hollis' Motorhome.

 Hell, it already even says "Minnie" on the side.

The kids will love it.  They could even get drunk on the mixed drinks that Andy is always talking about.  That should help them go to sleep quickly, and take a long nap.

---

Trying to get faster

Garfield:

Everyone is certainly entitled to their opinions, but I have a couple of questions:

1) Why is a Formula Junior any less a "Pro" than any other paid entrant?  Plenty of these kids have 5yrs+ experience and 3yrs+ of Pro Solo experience.

2) Why, when the event didn't fill for three months, is anybody griping about the kids "taking" spots?

Brian
 

 

I agree. I know the intent is to get more cars for the event, but the tone of the posts are anti-kid.  I say the more the merrier.  I wish I had been able to do this when I was 8.  The FJ carts are a blast to watch.  I'm amazed at how fast a lot of those kids are.  They beat a bunch of the cars.

---

Trey Davis
97 Subaru Impreza L, HS
ETR

As a parent of an FJ driver, I can see both sides of this argument.  I have not had my daughter participate in Pros, nor will I in the near future.  It is somewhat because of the traveling distances required for Pros and somewhat because of the reasons stated in this thread.  But, after reading what some of you big huge pricks have written here, I might do it just to piss you off.  Some of your heads are so big you can't see anything but yourselves,  WOW!

---

125 STS '89 Civic Si
RPGproduction.com/Toyo Tires/Moton/NABC-Ethanol Racing

TimSmith:

As a parent of an FJ driver, I can see both sides of this argument.  I have not had my daughter participate in Pros, nor will I in the near future.  It is somewhat because of the traveling distances required for Pros and somewhat because of the reasons stated in this thread.  But, after reading what some of you big huge pricks have written here, I might do it just to piss you off.  Some of your heads are so big you can't see anything but yourselves,  WOW!

Nice!  Call someone who doesn't agree a huge ***.    I guess I'll chime in.  Having run my daughter in FJR at a Pro, and at other larger events years in the past, I am against FJr classes at Pro's and at Nationals.  Nothing against the little guys and gals, I love 'em.  I just think it should be a local/Regional/Divisional thing to allow families to participate together.  I think it should be a "feeder" series, with the payoff for "graduating" out of FJr being allowed to run Nat's and Pro's.  It's too much too soon...the spirit of these classes should be participation, education, good sportsmanship, family activity, fun,...."competition" and winning should not be the foremost factor.  (Will it exist?  Of course, but it should not be the main focus.)  Placing this huge golden carrot out there to grab is just too much, and I really feel it is wrong.  Too much too soon.  It just seems better this way and more in keeping in line with what these classes are for....increasing membership and encouraging family participation.  Guess that makes me a huge *** too! 

---

Patrick Washburn
STU Evo - SOLD!
<----- 2009 - Regain the coveted Tri Pod Trophy for the Hiedi's

Patrick Washburn:

TimSmith:

As a parent of an FJ driver, I can see both sides of this argument.  I have not had my daughter participate in Pros, nor will I in the near future.  It is somewhat because of the traveling distances required for Pros and somewhat because of the reasons stated in this thread.  But, after reading what some of you big huge pricks have written here, I might do it just to piss you off.  Some of your heads are so big you can't see anything but yourselves,  WOW!

Nice!  Call someone who doesn't agree a huge ***.    I guess I'll chime in.  Having run my daughter in FJR at a Pro, and at other larger events years in the past, I am against FJr classes at Pro's and at Nationals.  Nothing against the little guys and gals, I love 'em.  I just think it should be a local/Regional/Divisional thing to allow families to participate together.  I think it should be a "feeder" series, with the payoff for "graduating" out of FJr being allowed to run Nat's and Pro's.  It's too much too soon...the spirit of these classes should be participation, education, good sportsmanship, family activity, fun,...."competition" and winning should not be the foremost factor.  (Will it exist?  Of course, but it should not be the main focus.)  Placing this huge golden carrot out there to grab is just too much, and I really feel it is wrong.  Too much too soon.  It just seems better this way and more in keeping in line with what these classes are for....increasing membership and encouraging family participation.  Guess that makes me a huge *** too! 

I am COMPLETE agreement with you.  For real!  My jab was at the attitude of SOME of the people disagreeing, not just those disagreeing.  If Nationals said today that there would be no more FJ at the national level, I would not complain.  No big deal.  They can wait until they can drive a car.  But, people shouldn't speak of the FJ drivers as if they are so insignificant and such a bother.

---

125 STS '89 Civic Si
RPGproduction.com/Toyo Tires/Moton/NABC-Ethanol Racing

TimSmith:

I am COMPLETE agreement with you.  For real!  My jab was at the attitude of SOME of the people disagreeing, not just those disagreeing.  If Nationals said today that there would be no more FJ at the national level, I would not complain.  No big deal.  They can wait until they can drive a car.  But, people shouldn't speak of the FJ drivers as if they are so insignificant and such a bother.

Yeah, I suppose some come off this way.  My thing, as stated here and in another thread I just started on this topic, isn't so much with "I'm losing a spot to some kids", but with the intended purpose and direction of the class as a whole.

---

Patrick Washburn
STU Evo - SOLD!
<----- 2009 - Regain the coveted Tri Pod Trophy for the Hiedi's

Just for your information that's Disimo in his Miata, and not a FJ.  Sheesh, are you knuckleheads blind !

All the guy does is shave off is stache, and the next thing you know know he's getting carded at R rated movies.

---

Trying to get faster

Howdy,

Dentspeed:

I agree. I know the intent is to get more cars for the event, but the tone of the posts are anti-kid.  I say the more the merrier.

Hey, so I'm slow and all (heh), but I think we put event caps in place to keep the # of entrants at a level that could successfully run during the day.

So if the FJ kids are running on the same course as the rest of us, you can damn well be sure they _will_ "count against the cap" no matter how the PR machine spins it.  This idea that "FJ kids shouldn't count against the cap" pretty much totally ignores that the cap exists for a reason, and the way that'll get implemented would be to either drop the "adult" cap a little, or raise the "real" cap a little.  Either way you do it, you still have an FJ kid taking up a slot that a non-FJ driver would fill, if you're assuming that the cap will be hit.

If you want to encourage more family participation at events, give parents work assignments that work well with needing to also be watching a kid, provide daycare (at some cost), etc.  FJ classes are for kids that can already watch themselves to a large degree, and its one _more_ thing for families to need to do during the day.  I mean, I'm sure its fun and all for the kids in question, but how many folks with kids are going to choose to come to a Pro or Nationals or whatever _strictly because the kid can run in FJ_?  I bet those people would still come, just the kid would have fun doing something else.

Mark

(parent of a 16 month old, wondering who he needs to talk to for the upcoming Pros about work assignments that will let me or my wife be free to watch our son...)

Patrick Washburn:

TimSmith:

As a parent of an FJ driver, I can see both sides of this argument.  I have not had my daughter participate in Pros, nor will I in the near future.  It is somewhat because of the traveling distances required for Pros and somewhat because of the reasons stated in this thread.  But, after reading what some of you big huge pricks have written here, I might do it just to piss you off.  Some of your heads are so big you can't see anything but yourselves,  WOW!

Nice!  Call someone who doesn't agree a huge ***.    I guess I'll chime in.  Having run my daughter in FJR at a Pro, and at other larger events years in the past, I am against FJr classes at Pro's and at Nationals.  Nothing against the little guys and gals, I love 'em.  I just think it should be a local/Regional/Divisional thing to allow families to participate together.  I think it should be a "feeder" series, with the payoff for "graduating" out of FJr being allowed to run Nat's and Pro's.  It's too much too soon...the spirit of these classes should be participation, education, good sportsmanship, family activity, fun,...."competition" and winning should not be the foremost factor.  (Will it exist?  Of course, but it should not be the main focus.)  Placing this huge golden carrot out there to grab is just too much, and I really feel it is wrong.  Too much too soon.  It just seems better this way and more in keeping in line with what these classes are for....increasing membership and encouraging family participation.  Guess that makes me a huge *** too! 

Is it the club's place to get involved in parenting decisions about values, education, etc?

---

clyde
#198 AS Boxster S - in need of SpinGuard
TeamWTF?!