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Where was the clarification in that thread?  I don't see any protest committee ruling?   Any decision on legality of this would go to a PC, the SMAC is merely an advisory body. 

Anything someone from the SMAC says on the subject is merely opinion, as they have no real power to decide legality.  They might be consulted for their input from a PC or the SEB if it gets appealed there, but that's about it.

-Andy M. 

 

Rodney:

boxboy:

So how wide are the Vette's running the 335's, anyway?  My RX7 is over 74" wide in the rear.

 -Andy M.

i would like to know as well. my civic is at 73" in the front, not exactly thin.... :P 

IIRC G-Tho's car was about 78" in SM2 trim.  I believe the C6Z06 is close to 80".  240sx was under 73" with 315s on 18x12.5's.

 Rodney, you must a agree that there is a difference, and in the case of SM, a very large potential difference, between "well prepped" and "prepped to the limit".

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--Jason Rhoades

Once someone can clearly define what the "limit" is, we can start debating it.

Until then, and as long as the rules use terms like "unrestricted" for things as large as "drivetrain", us five-figure racers wouldn't know the limit if it hit us in the face, and by the time we think we've got it, the seven-figure guys already have something 3 iterations better.

I do think it's safe to say we have examples of cars that are built to the point of serious diminishing returns for each additional dollar invested. This is something you can't say is true for XP yet, and probably won't be for 2-3 more seasons.

My MR2 is about 73" with the wide tires (285/335) and about 70" with the "narrow" ones (245/285). I'll probably be stuck at about 72-73" with the 275/285 combo. I think you'd be hard pressed to get narrower than 70" on almost any car with 275+ rubber. What's a CSP miata with 275s measure out at?

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Randy Noll

jzr:

 Rodney, you must a agree that there is a difference, and in the case of SM, a very large potential difference, between "well prepped" and "prepped to the limit".

 

no, i understand completely. my current car is well prepped, yet my new car will be at the limit.

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Hi! I'm Rodney. "Hi Rodney!" I'm addicted to Solo....

Howdy,

Rodney:

marka:

I've never seen _any_ "prepped to the limit" SM car period, including the car that won the national championship this year. What's your point?

calm down there cowboy... i have nothing against the domestic iron... i was saying f bodies/mustangs are few and far between in sm. creating a class just for that style car is pointless, as there are not many fielded. yes, i am probably biased as there are none running around me, but i cannot remember any national event where one showed up, much less prepped. actually, the romulus tour, there was a guy with a mustang i think. conversely, i think vic's car is pretty well prepped. you are saying my car is not well prepped?

I'm saying that other than possiblly a couple cars, SM is new enough and allows enough modification that the idea that you'd have a big field of "prepped to the limit of the rules" cars is insane.

My other point was that you don't see pony cars in SM because you'd have to be a complete f*cking moron to think that you could be competitive in one at a national level, even before the awd cars started making their mark.  Saying that the cars aren't there in this environment is a bit silly.  If SM Heavy existed, I bet the cars would be there.  There's a huge gap between ESP and CP that I know I and others wouldn't mind playing in.  It could also include "JDM pony cars" like the Supra, German pony cars like the M5, etc.

Mark

 

Howdy,

Rodney:

jzr:

Rodney, you must a agree that there is a difference, and in the case of SM, a very large potential difference, between "well prepped" and "prepped to the limit".

 

no, i understand completely. my current car is well prepped, yet my new car will be at the limit.

Really?  How many gears does the transmission have?  Dry sump?  Pneumatic valves?  Active diff?

"Rodney" isn't a screen name for Bill Gates is it?  :-)

Mark 

I want to see the custom lightweight hub assemblies and suspension arms.

The thing about SM is that "prepped to the limit" is a 6-figure proposition.  But hey, that's what we get with open ended allowances. :-)
 

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SM ~ '96 Subaru Impreza
Old Car: A Stock ~ 2000 Honda S2000

marka:

Really?  How many gears does the transmission have?  Dry sump?  Pneumatic valves?  Active diff?

Mark 

removed 2 gears, dry sump, no pneumatic (too much cost for little solo gain) active diff? it is fwd, a locker works darn good. 

adhowe70:

I want to see the custom lightweight hub assemblies and suspension arms.

that is the nice thing about hondas, they are already pretty darn light. there will be changes made though. car has 2 years worth of work, and it still doesn't run. one day.... 

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Hi! I'm Rodney. "Hi Rodney!" I'm addicted to Solo....

My XP miata is a CSP car suspension-wise (ie definitely not built to the limit :) ) so I can tell you that a CSP miata with 275s will be close to 72" wide. My car is apart right now so I can't re-measure but I think it was exactly 72" front & rear running 15x10 wheels w/ 6" bs. 6.5" bs would fit on the rear and maybe on the front if you are willing to give up even more turning radius, so 71" width may be possible.

geewiz:

My XP miata is a CSP car suspension-wise (ie definitely not built to the limit :) ) so I can tell you that a CSP miata with 275s will be close to 72" wide. My car is apart right now so I can't re-measure but I think it was exactly 72" front & rear running 15x10 wheels w/ 6" bs. 6.5" bs would fit on the rear and maybe on the front if you are willing to give up even more turning radius, so 71" width may be possible.

80", wow. That's wide.

-- Glenn

 

SM2/XP Toyota MR Spyder with 285 rears can be under 71" wide, no problem.

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Jesse
-2002-2006 E-stock 93 MR2 (sold)
-2007-2008 XP Spyder

So how wide are the Vette's running the 335's, anyway?  My RX7 is over 74" wide in the rear.

I can find out the dimensions for you.

Banging away at fiberglass to make more clearance of the inner fender liner is not a good idea since it really doesn't bend.

The "mini-tub" is a minor modification, but requires cutting and basically making the inner fender liner wider. I can provide a link to a previous post from Jake Latham, about this, and even the actually procedure if it wants to be seen

m

 

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Michael "MrPickles" Feldpusch
#144 SM2
Broomfield, CO
rmsolo.org
lefthandracing.com

I haven't seen it mentioned yet, forgive me if it has, but I sure would  like to see an allowance made for connecting torque arms to subframe connectors as God intended but which the SCCA curiously and specifically disallowed when it made its otherwise good decision to make SFC's legal in SP by way of 15.2.E.6.   That, by extension, made SFC's illegal as the forward attachment point for torque arms in SM thanks to 16.1.G which says subframe connectors are allowed "as per Street Prepared".     

Aside from being patently absurd, this restriction made any number of otherwise SM-legal cars illegal for SM in 2008, including mine, which happens to be a Mustang.

 I see comments about how Mustangs aren't competitive in SM at Solo Nats, and that is quite true, but I would like for the SCCA and this forum's participants to understand that its rulebook is used by thousands of members nationwide who never attend Nationals and that there are mustangs that are (or were) quite competitive on a local/regional basis, whose drivers pay SCCA dues, compete, have fun, spread the word and evangelize about the sport despite their absence at Nationals, and just about every one of them who were using a torque arm are now not legal for SM.

MFE:

I haven't seen it mentioned yet, forgive me if it has, but I sure would  like to see an allowance made for connecting torque arms to subframe connectors as God intended but which the SCCA curiously and specifically disallowed when it made its otherwise good decision to make SFC's legal in SP by way of 15.2.E.6.   That, by extension, made SFC's illegal as the forward attachment point for torque arms in SM thanks to 16.1.G which says subframe connectors are allowed "as per Street Prepared".     

Aside from being patently absurd, this restriction made any number of otherwise SM-legal cars illegal for SM in 2008, including mine, which happens to be a Mustang.

 I see comments about how Mustangs aren't competitive in SM at Solo Nats, and that is quite true, but I would like for the SCCA and this forum's participants to understand that its rulebook is used by thousands of members nationwide who never attend Nationals and that there are mustangs that are (or were) quite competitive on a local/regional basis, whose drivers pay SCCA dues, compete, have fun, spread the word and evangelize about the sport despite their absence at Nationals, and just about every one of them who were using a torque arm are now not legal for SM.

Write a well written letter to the SMAC that supports your claim as to why this should be added, along with possible wordings for how to add the rule without people being able to grossly abuse the rule for other issues, and you'll at least have it discussed among the SMAC.  That said... you're in Kansas City, so what's your excuse as to why you can't attend Solo Nationals? :)
 

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Jesse
-2002-2006 E-stock 93 MR2 (sold)
-2007-2008 XP Spyder

I sent an email to the SEB, how do I address the SMAC?

 As for Nationals, I never said I couldn't attend, but I've had to prioritize my vacation time to other endeavors.

MFE:

I sent an email to the SEB, how do I address the SMAC?

It will be routed there automatically for discussion.  There's no need to take any additional steps beyond your submission to the SEB.

Mike

 

msimanyi:

MFE:

I sent an email to the SEB, how do I address the SMAC?

It will be routed there automatically for discussion.  There's no need to take any additional steps beyond your submission to the SEB.

Mike

Keep submitting it until you get a return email with a log number. 

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Aut tace aut loquere meliora silentio.

modernbeat:

msimanyi:

MFE:

I sent an email to the SEB, how do I address the SMAC?

It will be routed there automatically for discussion.  There's no need to take any additional steps beyond your submission to the SEB.

Mike

Keep submitting it until you get a return email with a log number. 

Something tells me Doug wouldn't appreciate your "inundate him with work" approach.

 

I've been told that unless Doug gives it a log number there's no certainty that your letter every really existed.  Unfortunately, it seems Doug either doesn't get, doesn't log or doesn't respond to a significant amount of email directed to the SEB.  Unless Doug responds, I'd assume that he didn't get the letter to log.

Of course, I don't mean that we should flood his inbox with endless copies of the same message.  I would resend the same message once a week until I got a response (unless I knew Doug was away from his email, like at a Tour or Pro) noting that the message was sent previously without response containing a log number.  If Doug gets them all, doesn't respond and doesn't like it, he'll know what he needs to do to make it stop.  If, on the other hand, Doug actually isn't receiving the email that's sent to him (I've had this problem at work and the IT folks don't seem to know how to fix it), this method will make sure he sees the email sooner or later.

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SM ~ '96 Subaru Impreza
Old Car: A Stock ~ 2000 Honda S2000

How about dropping R compounds? Kinda limit stuff for people with higher horsepower....

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"Uhh.. Is smoke supposed to be coming from there?"

Sorry, but that is not even remotely under consideration.  If you want so little power that "street" tires are ok, then I politely suggest you run one of the Street Touring classes.  

-Andy M.