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Where are you guys buying your Toyos and who is shaving them for you?

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90 Miata/89 CRX - STS2 #90/190

hmm, good news on the 205/15.  Now its even harder to decide if  I want to wait for 225's

GChambers:

Where are you guys buying your Toyos and who is shaving them for you?

Gran Turismo East

http://www.granturismoeast.com

Garick:

hmm, good news on the 205/15.  Now its even harder to decide if  I want to wait for 225's

You are going to be waiting until the end of July for 225s :)  I figure I will kill the 205s by then, if not more.  Even then,  the 225s might not even fit on an EF.  Given that a 205 is .5" wider than a 195, a 225 might be a full inch wider than the 205.  Also, you are going to have to drastically change both your car setup and driving style to work with the Toyos.

-Brian 

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89/189 STS/STX '89 Civic Si

BrianGT:

... a 225 might be a full inch wider than the 205. 

For a good time, go have a look at the specs for the R-888 in the 225/45-15 size.  If the Toyo sizings hold within the manufacturer, Brian would be onto something.

Oh...but first...go get a drool cup.  You'll need it.

--Andy 

PS: Anybody notice that April 30th passed and no Kumho XS?  Bummer.  At least it makes the picture a little bit less fuzzy. 

Andy Hollis:

BrianGT:

... a 225 might be a full inch wider than the 205. 

PS: Anybody notice that April 30th passed and no Kumho XS?  Bummer.  At least it makes the picture a little bit less fuzzy. 

So we only have 3 different tires to worry about this year :) Bridgestone, Toyo, and Dunlop.

The width on the 225 is probably going to be a big issue for the EF's. If they can't fit it I wonder what cars will end up making significant ground on the EF's. Neon, Impreza, newer civics in STS. Maybe the RX-7 or the MR2 in STS2...

Ian
 

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--CRX Addict
--Recovered Mini Addict

So far the only contender I see is the Toyo which Andy says is better when it's cold (and we never have problems keeping heat in our tires, I don't know about you).  Aside from that I see tires that aren't any faster and wear out at least 2x faster (some have shown much more than than, like 4x).

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Jason Frank
Bridgestone / datatoys.com / Redshift Motorsports STS Civic Si

TeamUndercoatRacing.com

I'm confused on your post, Jason, the only tire that I've seen complaints about wearing out faster has been the Toyo. But your post sounds the opposite of that.  I'm wondering if there are posts/threads I've missed as I had been under the impression that the Bridgestones and the Dunlops were running neck in neck, and the Toyo was grippy but hard to drive and wore out super fast... is that an incorrect summary?

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Steve Nackers

R Street index HS. #723R
'98 BMW 318i
www.nsnmotorsports.com

TurfBurn:

I'm confused on your post, Jason, the only tire that I've seen complaints about wearing out faster has been the Toyo. But your post sounds the opposite of that.  I'm wondering if there are posts/threads I've missed as I had been under the impression that the Bridgestones and the Dunlops were running neck in neck, and the Toyo was grippy but hard to drive and wore out super fast... is that an incorrect summary?

Can you link to me some posts that shows the Dunlop's are close to the Bridgestones?  Maybe this has happened on the larger cars, I've only been pay attention to the smaller sizes (ie. STS and STS2 sizes).

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Jason Frank
Bridgestone / datatoys.com / Redshift Motorsports STS Civic Si

TeamUndercoatRacing.com

Links:

http://sccaforums.com/forums/permalink/298510/298474/ShowThread.aspx#298474

http://sccaforums.com/forums/permalink/298510/297741/ShowThread.aspx#297741

That's the best I've got without some additional digging.  Not a lot of direct data though that I've seen just more results based items.  It'd be nice to see some measurement data etc.  Also, the Tirerack online test seemed favorable with the Dunlops as well if you pay most attention to the performance measurements and ignore the ride comfort etc stuff.

I'm sure I've seen way less info than you, hence I was curious surprised as I was working under the impression based on what I have seen that the Dunlops were very close/competitive and it sounds like you do not feel that way so I'm also interested to know why that is.

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Steve Nackers

R Street index HS. #723R
'98 BMW 318i
www.nsnmotorsports.com

Mugenlude:

Can you link to me some posts that shows the Dunlop's are close to the Bridgestones?  Maybe this has happened on the larger cars, I've only been pay attention to the smaller sizes (ie. STS and STS2 sizes).

The extra diameter of the Dunlops in the small sizes seems to be making them a non-issue at this point in STS/STS2.  

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Brian Davis, 89 Civic Si, 158 STS

Yeah, I should have stated that there is nothing for STS/STS2 that has proven to be better than the Bridgestones.  Hopefully Washburn/Diestch will be at the Milwaukee Region event next weekend to get an idea of how they are... then again, we can run into course dependencies too.  I know there is one other guy in STU that is quick (the car isn't completely prepared), but it should give some idea of where they stand.

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Jason Frank
Bridgestone / datatoys.com / Redshift Motorsports STS Civic Si

TeamUndercoatRacing.com

Are most of you guys on a 15 or 16" rim?

It'll be interesting to watch the year as the tires shake out a bit, and see what next year brings...

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Steve Nackers

R Street index HS. #723R
'98 BMW 318i
www.nsnmotorsports.com

We have a sets of both....  the 15" seem to be more popular though.

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Jason Frank
Bridgestone / datatoys.com / Redshift Motorsports STS Civic Si

TeamUndercoatRacing.com

TurfBurn:

Are most of you guys on a 15 or 16" rim?

It'll be interesting to watch the year as the tires shake out a bit, and see what next year brings...

They are very close in performance and 15" wheels and tires are cheaper, so most folks are running the 15s.

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Brian Davis, 89 Civic Si, 158 STS

In the 16" size the Dunlops are an identical sidewall ratio (and offer one ratio smalle than the Bridgestone), what the actual height is though I don't know.  I was curious somewhat in regard to your earlier statement that in the small sizes they were too tall, which I can see in the 15" size with the 195/55/15 versus the 195/50/15.  But the 16" it would be somewhat irrelevant as you have both a 205/55 and 205/50 ratio available and a 225/50 as well with the bridgestone offering the 205/55 and 225/50 ratio.

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Steve Nackers

R Street index HS. #723R
'98 BMW 318i
www.nsnmotorsports.com

TurfBurn:

In the 16" size the Dunlops are an identical sidewall ratio (and offer one ratio smalle than the Bridgestone), what the actual height is though I don't know.  I was curious somewhat in regard to your earlier statement that in the small sizes they were too tall, which I can see in the 15" size with the 195/55/15 versus the 195/50/15.  But the 16" it would be somewhat irrelevant as you have both a 205/55 and 205/50 ratio available and a 225/50 as well with the bridgestone offering the 205/55 and 225/50 ratio.

The STS Bridgestones are 195/50-15 and 205/45-16.  The STS Toyo sizes 195/50-15, 205/50-15 and 205/45-16 (225/45-15 won't be out until late July).

 I don't see any of those sizes available in the Dunlop.  I heard they are made in the same factory as the Falken RT-615.  I wonder if they are similar.

-Brian

(by STS, I am referring to sizes that EF civics, crxs, and miatas will be running) 

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89/189 STS/STX '89 Civic Si

Mugenlude:

Yeah, I should have stated that there is nothing for STS/STS2 that has proven to be better than the Bridgestones.

Yeah, I really need to post up my testing data.  It does not agree with your statement above.

I'll try to get to it after the weekend (we're teaching Evo in Boston). 

--Andy 

BrianGT:

The STS Bridgestones are 195/50-15 and 205/45-16.  The STS Toyo sizes 195/50-15, 205/50-15 and 205/45-16 (225/45-15 won't be out until late July).

 I don't see any of those sizes available in the Dunlop.  I heard they are made in the same factory as the Falken RT-615.  I wonder if they are similar.

-Brian

(by STS, I am referring to sizes that EF civics, crxs, and miatas will be running) 

Gotchya... I didn't see the 205/45/16 when I looke don tire-rack as that would obviously be the same scenario as with the 15 inch size. 

 Factories don't mean a lot in most cases.  I work with a lot of injection molders and so forth in my day job and what I see is a HUGE variety of items that come out of plants built for a purpose like making a tire or making plastic parts.  Doesn't matter what the factory is only matters what the formulation of the rubber used during the molding, usually has to do more with floor space and production capacity as to why that would happen.  I'm sure Toyo turns out some of their boring street tires in the same factory as they likely turn out the R1R and similar situations with any other tire manufacturer.  But it is an interesting point though to see the Falken and the Dunlop coming out of the same facility if for nothing more than curiosity sake.

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Steve Nackers

R Street index HS. #723R
'98 BMW 318i
www.nsnmotorsports.com

Andy Hollis:

Mugenlude:

Yeah, I should have stated that there is nothing for STS/STS2 that has proven to be better than the Bridgestones.

Yeah, I really need to post up my testing data.  It does not agree with your statement above.

I'll try to get to it after the weekend (we're teaching Evo in Boston). 

--Andy 

Thanks (in advance) for sharing.  Damned if I could afford the Evo this year (unemployment bites!) and thus I missed a chance to meet you, which I regret.

Sincerely,

Charlie

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Charlie Thompson
'04 JCW Cooper [STX]
NER Cannon Fodder

Andy Hollis:

BrianGT:

... a 225 might be a full inch wider than the 205. 

For a good time, go have a look at the specs for the R-888 in the 225/45-15 size.  If the Toyo sizings hold within the manufacturer, Brian would be onto something.

Oh...but first...go get a drool cup.  You'll need it.

--Andy 

PS: Anybody notice that April 30th passed and no Kumho XS?  Bummer.  At least it makes the picture a little bit less fuzzy. 

 I was walking through the SCCA office today, and what did I see?  Two stacks of Kumho XS's: 6 tires in different sizes. The only question is whether there are more than those 6 Kumhos in the US, and can anyone (who doesn't have the initials KM) get them? :)
 

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David Avard
89 Honda Civic Si black (STS)
07 Mazda 3s (HS?)